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UPDATE: Got the Mac (re: Anyone have an effective Mac vs PC business case?)
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UPDATE: Got the Mac (re: Anyone have an effective Mac v... - 6/16/2006 11:43:32 AM
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angelabbf
Posts: 18
Joined: 6/16/2006
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UPDATE:
I finally begged and pleaded and made a zillion business case reasons why and got the management on my side... And the mac is on it's way. It just got ordered a few days ago. I'm expecting my 17" laptop and 23" flatscreen along with all the extras/bells and whistles to arrive late this week or early next week. I'm very excited. Thank you all for your tips/tricks.
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Hi. I work in-house and have been begging for a Mac upgrade for 1.5 yrs now with no luck. They want me to work on PC. I work in a large corp environment (ultra PC) and they really don't get the Mac. Does anyone have a really good business case that you could share to help my argument? Thanks!
< Message edited by angelabbf -- 9/25/2006 5:12:47 PM >
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RE: Anyone have an effective Mac vs PC business case? - 6/16/2006 11:46:48 AM
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Sagewing
Posts: 43
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I know I 'll get flamed for this, but there is no business case for Macs in a workplace. Depsite what you see on Apple advertising, the total-cost-of-ownership of a Mac is still much higher than a PC, and there are some 'interesting' aspects of teh compatibility.
I dont want to get into the m vs pc thing, but there are reasons that Mac has about 1/10th of 1 percent of the business world market share. Schools and freelancers are one thing, but when you have a support a larger organization Macs aren't quite there yet.
(ok lemme have it)
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RE: Anyone have an effective Mac vs PC business case? - 6/16/2006 11:49:45 AM
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angelabbf
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Thanks for the response... Maybe I should put it this way.... I REALLY want to continue to use a Mac. Even if the Business Case is BS, I'll try it. :)
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RE: Anyone have an effective Mac vs PC business case? - 6/16/2006 11:55:58 AM
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sillyelf
Posts: 2709
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From: Jacksonville, FL
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well maybe I have never worked on an awesome PC, but macs that are 2 to 3 years older seem to be faster and better at multi-tasking than new PCs, maybe its just me or maybe there is some stock to that and you can find some techno mumbo jumbo to back that up! =p
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RE: Anyone have an effective Mac vs PC business case? - 6/16/2006 11:59:28 AM
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bboyneko
Posts: 161
Joined: 6/4/2006
From: Laurel, MD (born in Bogota, Colombia)
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well there are two decent reasons:
1) Less Viruses
2) Video production
That's about it. If they get you a PC, I suggest you install styleXP or a similair XP theme changing software package. They have great themes that completley change the XP interface into a MAC-like UI, complete with same buttons and windows.
And get used to using CONTROL instead of the apple key :)
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RE: Anyone have an effective Mac vs PC business case? - 6/16/2006 12:03:13 PM
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sillyelf
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quote:
ORIGINAL: bboyneko
well there are two decent reasons:
1) Less Viruses
2) Video production
That's about it. If they get you a PC, I suggest you install styleXP or a similair XP theme changing software package. They have great themes that completley change the XP interface into a MAC-like UI, complete with same buttons and windows.
And get used to using CONTROL instead of the apple key :)
ooo good one, less viruses! totally true too
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RE: Anyone have an effective Mac vs PC business case? - 6/16/2006 12:09:00 PM
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Atealtha
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Unless there is software you need that is only available on a Mac, I see no reason to get one. Sure you might be more comfortable in it but that is not reason enough in business.
In my experience a Mac will take care of you if you take care of it. I've been using PCs at home. Everyone complains about popup, spyware, viruses, and all that. But they don't take care of their computer. I almost never run into that problem. I also see people with Macs with maxed out RAM that complain how software that costs them thousands of dollars crashes or is unreliable. Then there is the flipped version of that story. Oh yeah, my old job's shiny new G5 Mac had Quark crash on us p-l-e-n-t-y of times.
I think that whole stability issue depends on how you treat your computer. Personally I rather have a PC. Costs less, is more flexible in terms of hardware selection and has all the software that I need.
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RE: Anyone have an effective Mac vs PC business case? - 6/16/2006 12:29:20 PM
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ggraphics
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if your not used to being on a pc or arent very pc proficient that is a big reason to get your company to keep you on a mac. while you make the transition to a pc you will likely work slower as you get used to it and have more confusion about how to do things on it. i'm all mac and when i visit my family or my fiances family they only have pc's so just checking our email takes us a little longer in figuring what browser and how their set up works. we were trying to put photos on his brothers computer last time we were there but couldnt figure out the photo browsing software, it took us 20 minutes just to find it and his pc isn't that old, but it seemed to freeze and crash plenty.
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RE: Anyone have an effective Mac vs PC business case? - 6/16/2006 3:03:46 PM
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Sagewing
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These are all good points, but the reality is that if you look at it from the employers perspective:
1) Less viruses doesn't matter to the employer because they are already spending money (presumably) on virus control systems to support their PC base. One machine that is less vulnerable doesn't really mean any specific, material benefit to them.
2) Ease of use: Mac people think macs are easier, PC users think PC's are easier. Since Windows XP, they are both about the same and there is no data in either direction. It doesn't take long to make the transition, so businesses dont really consider it an important factor.
3) Multitasking/video production: Same thing. There are stats and figures all over the place, but no conclusive evidence that PC's or Macs are better at multitasking or even video production. In the past, Macs had stronger video production but almost all video production (and almost all audio production) that's performed outside the US is done on a PC. This is a verifiable fact. The reason? PC's can do the same thing for less $.
Business WANT productivity, and have to manage the bottom line. So, if these arguments were true there would be lots of Macs in business. Instead, Windows loses market share to linux/unix machines but it's very rare that a Mac takes the place of a PC in a medium to large business. It's hard to imagine why this would be the case if Macs had any real benefit.
The only good arugment for using Macs in business is just because you like them. I think that's the most valid argument there is.
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RE: Anyone have an effective Mac vs PC business case? - 6/16/2006 4:12:23 PM
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grafikdzinr
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I recently started a thread about this very topic within the hardware section of this site -- here's a link:
http://forum.howdesign.com/tm.aspx?m=81987
There were some really good responses that I used to put together a business case. But I will tell you that I'm not making very good progress where I work. The IT department is so narrowly focused that they will not even entertain the idea of discussing this issue with me!
As a note, I have always worked on a Mac until this job (been at it 3 months) but I still struggle with relearning short cut commands as I go home to an Apple at night where I do all my freelance work. So everyday it's back and forth. I've also had a helluva time trying to get accurate color, and generally I just feel that the way I interact with the PC via the mouse is not as responsive as it is on a Mac (this might be just in my head). One of the big reasons I wanted to be on a Mac is that it's the industry standard (by a wide margin) within the graphic design field. This means that publications, workshops, conferences, etc. are all assuming that you work on a Mac. I also know of at least 3 other talented designers that did not want to apply for additional positions with my current employer because of the Mac/PC issue. They have always worked on a Mac and are passionate about keeping it that way -- attracting/retaining talented individuals seems like a good business reason to me.
Anyway, if you'd like to take a look at the business case I put together PM me.
Good luck.
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RE: Anyone have an effective Mac vs PC business case? - 6/19/2006 9:21:52 AM
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Eggles
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It's a funny old world. I am in the opposite position - I have used PCs for 15 years, and in my most recent job, have had to use a Mac. It's the only Mac in a workplace of about 50 PCs. Aside from the issue of having to get used to working on a mac (and to be honest, once you're using a program, it's not really all that different, except for the shortcut keys, but since I started out with a PC, I've always been a right-clicker rather than a KB shortcutter - my theory is that the KB shortcut whizzes grew up with one-button Mac mice). I digress.
My major problem working in a PC environment is lack of technical support. We have a service contract with the Apple supplier, but it's the little itty gritty things for which you are not going to call in outside support, that are probably my biggest issue. e.g. one day the Mac hung at startup. On a PC, I would just Ctrl+Alt+Del, and if that didn't work, press the reset button. The force quit combo didn't work on the mac and of course, there's no reset button. In the end the IT girl just turned the power off!! And not being able to get one of the networked printers to work. Or not being able to connect to one of the network drives (where my archived files are stored). These sort of issues leave the ITs scatching their heads.
I would really love for the company to buy a PC in the next upgrade cycle - then to see if Adobe will allow cross-grade prices when CS3 comes out.
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RE: Anyone have an effective Mac vs PC business case? - 6/19/2006 2:43:35 PM
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Leanan
Posts: 521
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From: The Edge of the World near Seattle
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Actually, Adobe allows cross-platform upgrades (at upgrade pricing) now, but you have to call them and go thru some additional steps, you can't just order directly off thier site.
I'm torn between campaigning for a Mac or staying on my PC... it's easier from a support standpoint, but we work with Mac-based designers out of house and our sole in-house designer (I'm the Production Manager) is on a Mac, but I'm on a PC.
It's really frustrating dealing with IT on Mac issues tho, as all of our IT comes from a PC background.
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RE: Anyone have an effective Mac vs PC business case? - 6/22/2006 9:33:28 AM
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pantone583u
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One thing to consider are your fonts. If you have invested in a large font library for your Mac, most of them won't work on a PC (unless they are Open Type) but OT fonts haven't been around that long and at my work place most of our fonts aren't cross-platform.
As far as tech support, I suppose if you have a PC they will be able to help you with overall Window/networking type problems you may run into. But you will likely still be using non-standard software that no one else in the company uses, and any conflicts on PC you could run into with your software, they still won't be able to help you. And now that you're on PC, you probably won't be able to help yourself, either.
For as long as I can remember, out of the box Macs have been way ahead when it comes to colour--what you see on screen is much closer to what will print compared with a PC. Maybe PCs have come around in this aspect of late, but I've yet to see it.
Suppliers are another consideration. Are your printers able to work with PC files? Many nowadays are, but there are still some that aren't; particularly the smaller specialty printers that do letterpress and cool stuff like that.
I would bet you could pull up a lot of good reasons to stay Mac by browsing Apple's website here
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RE: Anyone have an effective Mac vs PC business case? - 6/25/2006 7:42:45 PM
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nordexpress
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We were on os9 until 6 months ago. When the discussion came up to upgrade, IT wanted to go pc (the corp is about 2,000 pcs vs. our 20 macs).
Our argument was very simply this ... If we went PC we would loose all our current staff and trying to find replacements would be doubly hard.
It was kind of a soft bluff, but it worked.
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RE: Anyone have an effective Mac vs PC business case? - 6/26/2006 6:36:40 AM
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lauren3g
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From: Chicago
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No one has mentioned this one... the screen is more accurate in terms of color on a mac... granted nothing will be perfect. I work on a pc at home and a mac at work. As much as I like a pc, for print the mac screen is sooo much better.
Also, our industry is mac standard. If they ever want to hire another designer they are limiting their choices. Eventhough I am quite fluent with a pc I would never take a graphic design job that won't let me work on a mac. Why, because my mac skills will become rusty. If I ever have to find another job it will be tough.
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RE: Anyone have an effective Mac vs PC business case? - 7/6/2006 1:26:18 PM
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DesignVHL
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I hear that Lauren! I'm the complete opposite of you, lol! I have a G5 Dual-core at home....and a crappy Dell PC at work. I'm looking to get out of In-house though....time for something new...yeah I may have to take a hit on the pay...but in the long run and for my SANITY I think it'll be worth it!
1. My boss doesn't know what a deadline is or how to give one.
2. My boss is a control freak (but getting better)
3. My Boss is NOT a designer and really doesn't know how to make one happy(nor is he a marketing guy...LOL the guy's an AUDIOPHILE for godsake!)
Sorry had to vent a few frustrations as I type it just came out...eh whatchagonnadoeh?
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RE: Anyone have an effective Mac vs PC business case? - 7/17/2006 4:20:59 PM
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the jones
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Eggles
My major problem working in a PC environment is lack of technical support. We have a service contract with the Apple supplier, but it's the little itty gritty things for which you are not going to call in outside support, that are probably my biggest issue. e.g. one day the Mac hung at startup. On a PC, I would just Ctrl+Alt+Del, and if that didn't work, press the reset button. The force quit combo didn't work on the mac and of course, there's no reset button. In the end the IT girl just turned the power off!! And not being able to get one of the networked printers to work. Or not being able to connect to one of the network drives (where my archived files are stored). These sort of issues leave the ITs scatching their heads.
next time this happens, just press and hold the startup button for five seconds, it powers the computer down. it is the default for a badly frozen mac. wait a few seconds, and then power up again.
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RE: Anyone have an effective Mac vs PC business case? - 7/19/2006 3:51:37 AM
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rapture
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There are plenty of reasons why graphic or video professionals should or would want to work on a Mac. Virii are indeed a large threat regardless of how much money is spent on anti-virus protection the fact is virii cause billions of dollars in damages to companies each year. For someone that does graphic work on source files that are probably very difficult to reproduce (it's a bit different from just having to retype that report again) having a Mac where Virii are almost non-existent means something. While new G5's now run Intel based processors I still see a dramatic difference in process multi tasking while switching from programs like Photoshop to Flash to Illustrator to two or three different web browsers. Even with a PC with similiar hardware specs the Mac still performs better.
As far as cross compatibility I have never received from any IT department solid proof or reasons technically speaking why the Mac is not compatible with a standard existing PC networks OTHER than company personalization. What I mean by this is that a lot of companies run proprietary software or network systems to minimize security risks or maximize internal efficiency. Also things such as remote administration or monitoring systems are designed to work within PC based environments since Mac compatibility are not programmed in because of Apple's relatively low share in the business market. If this is the case and the company has invested significant money and time into custom systems that have been created to maximize the company security, and efficiency than those are possible reasons why introducing a Mac is opposed. When dealing with IT also it's always been a small factor of introducing technical elements of which they don't know, can't support, or can't monitor. Having a rogue element in their corporate network can cause plenty of IT professionals to wake up in cold sweats at night.
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RE: Anyone have an effective Mac vs PC business case? - 7/19/2006 1:04:13 PM
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erricoellen
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I worked on a weekly newspaper and 2 monthly magazines on a PC format for 2 and a Half years. Never, ever again will I do work on a PC, here's why.
1. It took forever to use photoshop on the PC, in fact, we had MACS in our art department for scanning and color-correcting photos because you cannot effectively color-correct photos in photoshop on a pc. If I tried to open up a layered file in Photoshop on a PC, it took forever, but I could open up the same exact file on the MAC and I would have no problems.
2. The PC's crashed all the time. All the time. We would open quark and it would crash. We also had a lot of problems with our quark documents getting corrupted on the PCs and there were several times we had to start from scratch on projects they would get so badly corrupted.
3. Font issues. We had tons of font issues with the PC's. They were constantly getting corrupted as well.
I have a new job and have a new G5 and I freaking love it. Have never had a problem with it. Go with the G5, you will not be sorry.
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